My Question on the Ridgeline Being "All the Truck Anyone Needs"

"jdrgoat - Ponticrack?" (jdrgoat) 02/16/2016 at 21:12 • Filed to: None

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I know it’s an unpopular opinion for many people, to consider the new Ridgeline as being all that most people need for their standard trucking duties. I understand both sides of that coin.

I know that it wouldn’t work for towing the boat that many people use frequently. It wouldn’t be enough for towing a horse trailer which is a common occurance in many other peoples’ lives. And it wouldn’t be good at towing a race car or picking up a car and trailering it home from 1000 miles away.

Then there’s the other side of that argument. If you drive the truck, usually with no one else in the vehicle, why do you need something so big? Taking up more room in a modern compact car parking lot than necessary. Burning more fuel than necessary at the detriment of your own wallet and some might say to the environment.

Here comes the new, smaller trucks. Fixing most of those issues with driving big trucks every day! Right!?

So... why doesn’t the Ridgeline offer a 4 cylinder engine?

The competition all does... The Colorado offers a modern 4 cylinder. The Tacoma offers a not-as-modern 4 cylinder in its refreshed self. The Frontier offers a not-as-modern 4 cylinder in its not-as-refreshed self.

Honda makes modern 4 cylinder engines, and they practically built their reputation on 4 cylinder engines. So... opinions on why the Ridgeline hasn’t announced (and I would bet against it existing ever) a 4 cylinder version? A K-series would be perfect against the competition. They even already make versions with competitive displacement in this segment!

Unless it’s just not going to happen because they want to silence some of the fire going on the “not a real, and manly, truck” argument... I don’t see it.

Pictured for some people’s enjoyment (such as mine) is my “truck enough” 4 cylinder, manual transmission, Colorado.

OPPOsaurus WRX > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 21:17

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I would bet #1 is FWD

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 21:18

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Wait... the 06 Ridgeline tows 5,000lbs. That’s more than enough for most small boats and race cars on open trailers

V6 or Bust > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 21:22

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Towing boats isn’t as hard as you think. I the eighties, my dad towed his speedboat behind a Buick Regal V6. Additionally, Mr. Regular always says that the Honda Pilot, which shares a platform with the Ridgeline, is made for towing boats.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > OPPOsaurus WRX 02/16/2016 at 21:23

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Being FWD definitely doesn’t stop it from being a 4 cylinder. Why wouldn’t they offer one?

Birddog > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 21:23

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Need.. Need.. Need... This is all you really need. Blablabla.

People buy what they want or in most cases what they think they want. Not what they need.

Why doesn’t Honda offer a 4 cylinder? Because Honda is bloody smart. They know damn well nobody is going to buy a 4 banger Ridgeline.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > V6 or Bust 02/16/2016 at 21:24

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That’s true. I was kind of fluffing the fire against the Ridgeline. I have launched a boat myself with a 1989 Oldsmobile. You can even use fwd to launch a boat just fine.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 02/16/2016 at 21:26

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I was fluffing the case against the Ridgeline. But most people, I guess, think of larger boats. And I can’t imagine a race car showing up at a dirt track behind a Honda anyways... but it’s certainly possible.

But my question is really why they wouldn’t offer a 4 cylinder version, since it’s supposed to just be a day-to-day truck.

Conan > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 21:27

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I think certain groups of militants have made a superior argument for the Hilux being all the truck anyone needs.

OPPOsaurus WRX > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 21:33

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Ha-ha I’m tired I wanst paying attention to what you were asking. I was thinking y people wouldn’t want a ridgeline.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > Birddog 02/16/2016 at 21:33

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Good point here... I mean, I am fine with my truck being slow because “I don’t care, it’s a truck.” I think that a 4 cylinder version would offer better fuel economy for those people that care.

But Honda doesn’t need to help their fuel economy numbers by offering a 4 cylinder version. All they sell is tiny fuel efficient cars. CAFE doesn’t worry about them.

They could sell them, if they made them and advertising wanted to make a point of their potential fuel economy.

HammerheadFistpunch > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 02/16/2016 at 21:34

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I thought the new one was up to 6500 lbs (6300 with awd)? Thats more than enough for any boat i would pull behind something smaller than a half ton

HammerheadFistpunch > Birddog 02/16/2016 at 21:35

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Its true, in most cases the mileage gains for the 4 cylinder is minimal and this is never going to compete in a fleet market so why would they?

OPPOsaurus WRX > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 21:47

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How are the 4cyl mpg’s compared to 6's? When I was looking at Sport Tracs the 6's and 8's were within 1 mpg because the 6 had to work harder

Birddog > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 21:48

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As HammerheadFistpunch pointed out below the MPG gains would probably be negligible.

SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman > HammerheadFistpunch 02/16/2016 at 21:49

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Tow capacity hasn’t been announced so I have no idea if 6500 is right or no

CPT Speedbump > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 22:02

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In the case of the Colorado though, 1 of the 4 cylinder options offers towing..because diesel.

CPT Speedbump > HammerheadFistpunch 02/16/2016 at 22:04

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If you compare that to the 7700 pound tow rating on the 4 cylinder diesel Colorado though... I’ll take the Colorado please

Scott > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 22:09

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Because as of yet we don't live in a Bernie Sanders one size doesn't fit all world. While you may not need a truck but want to drive something that looks like a truck, many of us do need a real truck, and do use it's capabilities. Rather than making broad assumptions about everyone else based upon your own situation, let people be free to decide for themselves.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > Scott 02/16/2016 at 22:28

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So why not make more options for the people? Some people will want a 4 cylinder version to get better fuel economy (if I remember right, the previous Ridgeline did same fuel economy numbers as the full-size anyways). The competition offers it, why not Honda?

Busslayer > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 22:33

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So how come people always say someone has “too much truck” but you don’t here people arguing people buy “too much car?”

Isn’t anything more than a Fiesta too much car? A Fiesta seats 5, why buy a Camry which doesn’t provide any aadditional functionality.

Or why buy a GT350 when it does no better job commuting than a Veloster?

Gone > SnapUndersteer, Italian Spiderman 02/16/2016 at 23:26

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The Ridgeline doesn’t leave you much room for error based on its capacities.

Curb weight: 4500lb + hitch = 4600lb

GVWR: 6050

GCWR: 10085

Alum flatdeck 18' dovetail trailer 1600lb

Winch + batt + storage box + tirerack + spare trailer tire = 325lb

Avg caged car, say C4 - 2900 lbs

Driver - 185, track bag - 10lb, cooler/food+ice 35lb + 50lbs misc crap - batt cables, tiedowns, breakdown gear, etc

Tools + rotors + pads + jack + 1 set wheels/tires + gloves + rags + oil/brake/water/clutch fluids etc= 375lbs

2 fuel cans + fuel - 90lbs

Trailer weight = 1600+2900+325+375+90 = 5290lbs -no, so some spares go to the bed, but now at max tow - 5000lbs

Truck = 4600 + 185 + 10 + 35 + 50 + 290 + 500lb hitch weight = 5670, so well under GVWR...but

Total weight = 10170. 85lbs of oops. That’s pretty minimal, but add a wife and then you have to pull 185lbs out. Co-driver, 270lbs, plus GVWR starts getting tight at 5855. It’s workable if you’re smart and minimize your extras, but it’s not as simple as pack your shit and go. The numbers are just too tight.

EcoDiesel Rams are real bad about this too. GVWR is so small you can’t carry much in the bed or when you have 920lb tongue weight, it really limits your cargo capacity, since GVWR gives you only ~1400lbs cargo capacity.

DanZman > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/16/2016 at 23:29

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I honestly don’t understand these “smaller” trucks at all. They are barely smaller and get barely better fuel economy for a barely lower price. All while sacrificing utility and interior space. I just don’t get it. I really wish that we could go back to the barebones little trucks of the 80's too, but we all need to face reality that it’s never gonna happen again. Mahindra was our only hope.

Also, nice looking truck. I'm assuming it matches your GTO?

HammerheadFistpunch > CPT Speedbump 02/16/2016 at 23:29

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jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > OPPOsaurus WRX 02/17/2016 at 00:07

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From what I’ve seen (on fuelly), there is an actual noticeable difference in the economy. I would describe the V6 as pretty much the same fuel economy as a full-size, and the 4 cylinder (gas)is actually doing as advertised. I’ve been doing around the EPA combined number while occasionally having to give it the beans. I am also, somehow, getting the (second) best economy of any 2015 on fuelly, but I am also doing a lot more city driving than the other one. Here's my fuelly.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > Busslayer 02/17/2016 at 00:08

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Don’t ask me, haha. I have a 4 cylinder truck and an 8 cylinder car. I’m not going to argue with or defend either side, just here to observe... And wonder why there’s no 4 cylinder Ridgeline.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > DanZman 02/17/2016 at 00:13

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I wish we could have an 80's sized truck, too. Actually, make that an El Camino for me. (I can’t pay Left Hand Ute prices, otherwise I might.)

As far as the reason for the trucks, well, modern trucks have gotten pretty large. I don’t have my pictures on this computer, but I’ve got a bunch of pics next to normal 1500 trucks where my truck looks like a toy. It also does all the truck stuff I need, and I have yet to get less than 20mpg since the first tank. I don’t think that most new full-size trucks average 23.5mpg over 10k miles, unless you spend huge percentages of time on the highway.

Thanks for the compliment. Yep, the GTO and Colorado match, along with their stablemate motorcycle. And I wasn’t planning on buying a yellow GTO when I was shopping, either. It started this whole thing.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > HammerheadFistpunch 02/17/2016 at 00:15

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I think that may be the answer. It just seems that some vehicles which make their own space in the market destine themselves to die out. Like the first Ridgeline. If you can’t directly shop it against a competitor, the competitor will always have the upper hand in the long term. So even though it makes sense to just make the “best” version since they don’t have to care, I’m not sure how smart that will be in the long term.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > Birddog 02/17/2016 at 00:17

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So if they only offer a not best in class V6, with not best in class economy, and you don’t have an option as a consumer... why should I sacrifice the utility? Even if it’s perceived utility that I would never need, where’s the trade off? It didn’t work last time...

HammerheadFistpunch > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/17/2016 at 00:20

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who’s to say its not best in class economy? It wasn’t last time but its looking good this time around.

Birddog > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/17/2016 at 00:22

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It’s not me, it’s them. Chill man.

Spoon II > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/17/2016 at 00:50

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Honestly, I would trade in my truck on a Ute in a second. Especially an AWD ute.

DanZman > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/17/2016 at 01:09

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Yeah its truly sad that no one can make something that simple and small again. I really believe that we would have gotten an american ute if the banks hadn’t fucked the american economy with the mortgage crisis and subsequent shuttering of pontiac.

I drive a ‘14 Silverado and I am blown away every time that I see a new colorado/canyon by how big they are. I parked next to one once and it was nearly the same size. Also, I average about 20mpg, but can get closer to 23 if I don’t drive it like my corvette. It has the larger 5.3 V8 and comfortably pulled a 4,ooo+lb trailer from NH to AZ. I don’t use all of its capacity every day, but I’m glad that I have it. The truck is about 16months old and has about 45k mi on it already.

I do really like the looks of the smaller trucks. They are like night and day better than their predecessors.

Do you have any pics of your “yellow fleet”?

Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer > DanZman 02/17/2016 at 07:16

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It’s about 6" wider than my 1st gen, and that’s so small you don’t need to have any parking skills at all. Seriously, if you can’t get it to stay between the lines you shouldn’t be driving. It’s about 2" NARROWER than a Golf, which means the new one isn’t exactly a giant either.

Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer > Busslayer 02/17/2016 at 07:20

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I’ve tried this tack before. It doesn’t go over well.

Personally I consider a small-midsized truck the best all rounder on sale, in all areas. Full sizes aren’t terribly far behind. They’re a compromise vehicle, and now they drive pretty well too, so... It’s not a mazzive tradeoff anymore. I can see exactly why trucks sell so well. If you have one vehicle, why not make it one that will do everything?

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > HammerheadFistpunch 02/17/2016 at 09:34

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I’m jumping to conclusions, I know. But have there been any major modifications to the drivetrain since the previous one? Does a 2016 Pilot get much better economy than a 2007?

[Researches in the background... returns.]

Still a 3.5L V6, but they have new transmissions. The Pilot has both a 6 speed and a 9 speed automatic. The 9 is rated 1 better in city and combined. I would be a little bit surprised to see them use that in the Ridgeline as standard, they’re playing too conservative for that.

The new Pilot is rated 19/26/22 with the 9 speed, which happens to be identical to the rating on my Colorado with a 4 cylinder and a truck bed.

Maybe this will be closer than I thought. (At least when you straight compare gas to gas.)

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > Birddog 02/17/2016 at 09:36

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“Ah, that’s better. I get to be a drama queen when I’m hungry.”

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > Spoon II 02/17/2016 at 09:37

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If they weren’t so expensive after the conversion, I would probably want to trade both my truck and my GTO for a Ute. They’re just that awesome.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > DanZman 02/17/2016 at 10:16

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The American automakers were in a lot of trouble before the banks screwed up, so in the end I think it may have been best that the problem came to such a head. Even if it did end up doing some bad things like getting rid of Pontiac (never should have happened still...), I think it finally gave them some power back over the UAW. (They were paying out 4 full pensions, including zero-deductible healthcare, which included dependents and spouses, for every employee that they had currently working. Just for starters. Yeah, that’s a good way to keep a company afloat...)

That said, the G8 ST and G8 (what were they going to call the wagon version?) were both in the pipeline and supposedly a sure thing... until Pontiac was no more. I imagine the Ute would have sold not too many, and then held their value really well.

The new mid-sizers are taller than they need to be, which I think adds to how big they are and look. But when you compare them from the front, it’s easy to see where the Colorado is smaller than the Silverado. The down side is that I can’t fit a piece of 4x8 flat in the bed. But it’s easier to maneuver in a parking lot, which I do way more often than transporting plywood.

I’m impressed by the economy of your 1500... have you been calculating the numbers, or just going by the dash? It’s amazing what they can do these days! 15 years ago that would have seemed impossible. Now I want to know what a 1500 with the new 4.3L and backed by an 8-speed would do. It would probably approach the upper 20's on the highway like my truck, and not be quite as slow. I would say that you do a lot more highway driving than me, to pile on the miles about 4.5x as fast. ;) I just hit 10k this morning which took about 8 months.

I need to get a fleet shot soon. I actually have a friend who also has a yellow Ram 1500, yellow 350Z, and a yellow Buell... we just need to make time to get them together and take pictures. I’ve posted a couple around on here of them by themselves (minus the bike). And now I think I need to find pics of your C6Z again. Man, I want one of those... Fiero will do for now.

HammerheadFistpunch > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/17/2016 at 10:17

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That (the 9 speed) is the sole transmission in the ridgeline.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > HammerheadFistpunch 02/17/2016 at 10:26

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Color me impressed. It might do better than I thought on the test schedule. Now just imagine it with a 4 cylinder K24 option.

J_P_Cars10s > jdrgoat - Ponticrack? 02/13/2017 at 23:24

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Props for actually buying a new vehicle with a manual and not just complaining about the lack of availability on the internet. Excellent color as well.

After driving my 6MT Outback with over 800lbs of building materials in the back a few times and towing about 2000lbs once, I agree that a large (2.5l+) 4 cylinder could probably work in the Ridgeline.

It really comes down to marketing and America’s flawed perception of what a truck should be. Check out the fake bed/cab gap...

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > J_P_Cars10s 02/14/2017 at 11:26

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The US is a market all its own when it comes to trucks. It makes sense why they’ve evolved this way, in a sense... but it’s also not logical.

Did you know that full-size GM trucks, in 2wd (which was by far the norm), had rear coil springs in the 60's? Maybe that was a lot more common than I’m aware, but they were all leaf springs for a long time until Ram brought the “more comfortable” coil springs back recently. So it’s not like trucks always were the hugeness that they are now, and everyone survived just peachy.

If the Ute actually made it to the US, that’s what I would be driving.

I have heard a good reason that the gap exists. I haven’t investigated one in person to see, but that gap allows them to make that panel with two pressings, which equals a good amount of savings. That’s a plus, I’m fine with that gap.

jdrgoat - Ponticrack? > HammerheadFistpunch 12/22/2017 at 00:44

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Not to bring up a dead horse, but I guess the Ridgeline only has the 6 speed, the 9 isn’t even available. Honda is still being very conservative.